F4U vs Zero a6m-zero. F8F vs Zero Prev Next . Reflecting this set of opposite characteristics was the fact that the Zero’s standard evasive manoeuvre was the very opposite to that of the Spitfire – upwards rather than downwards, in the form either of a climbing turn or a vertical aerobatic manoeuvre like a loop, stall turn or Immelmann. Both the newer and older types were encountered over Darwin. Page 2 of 3 < Prev 1 2 3 Next > syscom3 Member. Other than the downward break, no other evasive manoeuvre by the Spitfire was likely to work, although a vertically-banked climbing turn was difficult for the Zero to follow. They found that the Zero had a lower rated altitude than the Spitfire, 16 000 feet against 21 000 feet, which delivered the Spitfire a good speed advantage at height – it was 20 knots faster at 26 000 feet. In comparative tests at 17 000 feet, the Spitfire was again unable to safely draw away from the Zero. Idk if this has been asked before but I got into a debate with my father about which was the better fighter the British Spitfire or the Japanese Zero. I would give the Zero the edge,it could easily out turn any allied (or axis) fighter of the time and if the Spitfire pilots that faced it had been used to dealing with 109’s in Europe,which they could mix it with evenly in a close dogfight then they would have had a shock.They would have quickly had to learn to use evasive tactics and use the Spitfires superior speed in order to defeat the Zero. But a Fw-190 spitfire's fight. Your email address will not be published. These differing technical characteristics determined the pattern of relative performance between the two machines, as shown by the tactical trials conducted by two experienced RAAF fighter pilots in flying trials conducted over three flying days[2]. However, it is odd that they had continued to esteem these qualities over those of other fighters in spite of the fact that they were of only secondary importance tactically. The 5.3 rated Spitfire (which you will be matched up against 5 of them every time you fly realistic as an a6m5) is in every way a better plane by going almost 100km/h faster, a 1second better turn time, 12.7's instead of 7mms, and a vastly better climb speed. This was established beyond any doubt during comparison trials in August 1943 between one of the RAAF’s Spitfire VCs and a Model 32 Zero that had been captured in New Guinea and rebuilt at Eagle Farm airfield in Brisbane. The more powerful engine was heavier, requiring a reduction in fuel capacity from 518 litres to 470, and more thirsty; thus range was less than that of the earlier model. Even in a dive the Spitfire still accelerated too slowly to avoid the Zero’s gunfire. Discussion in 'Air War in the Pacific' started by scrounger, Apr 3, 2011. Japan began the Pacific War with two major technological advantages over the U.S. Navy: the much more reliable Long Lance torpedo, and the Mitsubishi A6M Zero carried-based fighter, a … The Zero, extremely nimble at low speeds was purpose-built as a shipboard fighter. V, climb cart, speed chart. It was not hardly a fair match. CAPTCHA Code * Recent Posts. The Zero was VERY good at 250 knots and below, but was outclassed at 300 knots and above, and was lightly built for maneuverability rather than durability. Thus it is doubly ironic that the Spitfire’s reputation would habitually be established by reference to archaic, non-tactical criteria, and that the new Japanese opponent would trump every one of the Spitfire’s purported trademark virtues: in effect, ‘whatever you can do, I can do better’. A zero vs a spitfire I would like to see that to make a prediction I believe a Zero has got the SPit. Indeed, in these respects it had similar tactical characteristics to other early-war allied fighter aircraft - such as the P-39, P-40, and F4F Wildcat – in that it possessed a clear superiority in one tactical mode: diving fast into the attack and then performing rolling downward evasion. At 6G (a hard turn or pull out at high speed, with the pilot blacking out), the Spitfire stalled at 184 knots IAS, which equated to 257 knots TAS at 20 000 feet, and 294 knots at 30 000. Above 20 000 feet, so long as the Spitfire started with a 3-4000 feet height advantage, the Spitfire could make dive and zoom attacks with impunity. Certainly, the Spitfire's armament was good and it was an excellent gun platform. Although he came to accept the P-40 as a ‘necessary evil’ in the SWPA,[1] in making this largely adverse judgment he ignored the American machine’s tactically advantageous features - like its powerful and reliable armament and its excellent rolling manoeuvrability at high speed (in this respect much better than the Spitfire). Products of vastly different design philosophies, the Seafire F III and the A6M Zero were never intended to meet in combat, and never should have. The pattern established in these tests confirmed the findings of operational experience over Darwin, where the Spitfires were always able to dominate the upper height band without Japanese challenge. The conclusions of Wawn and Jackson only corroborated the earlier evaluation conducted by 1 Fighter Wing HQ[6] after combat experience over Darwin, which found that the Spitfire had a higher maximum speed, that it was more manoeuvrable at high speed, and that it could be dived to a greater speed. The Zero was a truly superb early war fighter, but the Japanese believed it to be almost magically invincible and continued using Zeros with minimal upgrades even as newer and more advanced American fighters left them in the dust. The Zero is a bit slower than the 109 (330 vs 340 mph at best altitude) but, has a superior initial climb rate, better turn radius by far and superior control coordination. In short, it was too easy for a Zero to evade a Spitfire at medium altitudes and below, by simply performing any vertical manoeuvre or hard turn. Hurricane has 0 cards to play. Both had achieved admirable records. Spitfire Mk. Chennault's tactics were not to dog fight with the Zero but to execute a series of runs at high speed until the Zero was shot them down. With all his experience, he should have realised that air combat would not be decided by close-in dogfighting with enemy fighters, whether against the Germans over Europe or against the Japanese over New Guinea. The Japanese "Zero", officially the Mitsubishi A6M5, or Imperial Japanese Navy Type 0 carrier-borne fighter. When RAAF Spitfire pilots like Keith ‘Bluey’ Truscott were posted back to Australia for assignment to the RAAF’s newly-formed Kittyhawk squadrons, they similarly dismissed the heavy American fighter. The film named ‘Eternal Zero’ is about a fictional Japanese pilot, Kyuzo Miyabe, and his career flying through the skies during World War 2. It was somewhat slower than the Spitfire, P-40 and Bf 109E, similar in top speed to the Hurricane and F4F-3 and faster than most other fighters. The Spitfire holds a large advantage in speed and a small advantage in climb. Spitfire vs Zero Stats. V. Here are the performance charts for those planes: A6M3. Being able to fly more slowly while still under complete control meant the Zero could fly tighter turns without stalling out. AVIATIA - Aircraft specifications and performance - comparison site. Spitfire vs. 1 Fighter Wing’s recommended tactics at this point were correct: either to zoom back up after firing or disengage by continuing the high speed dive downwards. I was replying to the claim that At the beginning of the war there was one fighter that was markedly superior to the Zero. The height advantage of the Spitfire VC was also shown by the British machine’s superior operational ceiling. However, despite the gloomy overall assessment provided by the comparative tests, the relative situation was not unfavourable to the Spitfire. It was only at higher speeds that the Spitfire started to enjoy a relative advantage. In that timeframe I'm putting up the A6M3 vs. the Spitfire Mk. Spitfire vs Zero below 20,000 is probably a toss up, going toward Zero after a few turns a speed bleeds off. Spitfire Mk.V and Zero A6M2/21 (the PH Zero) are close contemporaries. Bf-109 vs Zero a6m-zero. The superiority of the Spitfire’s ceiling is corroborated by its 5000 feet higher rated altitude, by 1 Fighter Wing’s demonstrated tactical employment of the Spitfire at heights up to 33 500 feet, and by the Zero pilots’ avoidance of the height band above 30 000. The P-40 Warhawk and A6M Zero were two prominent U.S. and Japanese fighters at the beginning of the Second World War. The chief difference lay in its more powerful Mitsubishi Sakae 21 engine, which developed 1130 hp (as compared with 940 hp in the Model 21). Joined: ... 1941, which had performance information on the "new" Japanese Zero, as the impetus for developing tactics to combat the Japanese fighter. Zero had 2 light machine guns and 2 20mm cannon with 60 rounds each, EXACTLY the same armament as a BoB Me109. Spitfire V mentions "FW-190 is more maneuverable than Spitfire V except in turning circles where it is outturned without difficulty". Nonetheless, it was a Model 32 Zero that was captured and rebuilt, permitting the trials to occur in August 1943. © 2020 - Comparison - BVR - Dogfight. Re: Japanese thought on the P-38 vs. the Zero Cancel Reply. The Ausies Held the skies but at great cost in fighters. This helps to explain the high incidence of Spitfires stalling and spinning out of combat turns over Darwin in 1943. Bf-109 vs Zero a6m-zero. [1] Ivan Southall (1958) Bluey Truscott, Sydney, p.153-156. No. Along with the Bf 109E, the Zero was the most heavily armed fighter of its time and introduced the use of cannons in fighter planes. This was a product of the Japanese machine’s superior power loading and lower wing loading. Neither aircraft had a good roll rate at high speed, due to their ailerons locking almost solid in the airflow. This meant it would be very difficult for a Spitfire to get a shot at a manoeuvring Zero. Spitfire is about 25 mph faster and will climb faster but the Zero can climb much steeper. If a Spitfire followed a Zero around in a loop, it would stall out at the top, and could only stay behind the Zero for ¾ of a horizontal turn. The Vought F4U Corsair is an American fighter aircraft that saw service primarily in World War II and the Korean War. Japanese Zero vs Spitfire vs FW 190 Thread starter Chiron; Start ... Spitfire is about 25 mph faster and will climb faster but the Zero can climb much steeper. They found that the Zero had a lower rated altitude than the Spitfire, 16 000 feet against 21 000 feet, which delivered the Spitfire a good speed advantage at height – it was 20 knots faster at 26 000 feet. The Spitfire had about half the range, 1000 miles verse nearly 2000. The only practical firing opportunity for Spitfire pilots would come in a bounce. CAPTCHA Code * Recent Posts. F8F vs Zero a6m-zero. However, as had already been noted by RAF Fighter Command in Europe, the Spitfire had relatively slow acceleration, and thus the Zero was able to stay behind the Spitfire within gun range while the Spitfire gradually accelerated away out of range. Rightfully, a whole generation of pilots learned to treasure the Spitfire for its delightful response to aerobatic manoeuvres and its handiness as a dogfighter. The conclusion was that the Spitfire was more manoeuvrable above 220 knots, while the Zero was the better below that speed. Your email address will not be published. All Rights Reserved. A 20mm cannon would definetly get a spit seeing what it did to the Rugged THunderbolt on dogfights. Although Spitfires endeared themselves to pilots by their sweet flying qualities, it is clear that the Zero too had impeccable manners. It followed that the only sensible offensive tactics were the dive from height followed by a zoom climb for a re-attack. In the early years, there can be only one choice. Leave A Reply. It was also respectably fast for 1940, with a top speed of 331 MPH. Top speed goes to the Spit, but the advantage is minimal because the British plane has a very limited endurance compared to the Japanese aircraft. Cancel Reply. P-38 vs Zero f4u-corsair. In contrast, the Spitfire was intended to operate from established airfields, and needed to be adapted as a carrier fighter. The stall speeds cited apply to straight and level flight at 1G – hardly a realistic scenario in combat, where pilots would typically stall out of accelerated turns. P-38 vs Zero a6m-zero. The Japanese had the N1K2-J Shiden-kai, Ki-84 Frank, and the Ki-96 (great power to weight!). The 80th Fighter Squadron has twice encountered “Tony” type fighters … That was the P-38 Lighting. P-47 vs Zero Prev Next . ... have to include the Spitfire, the Mustang, the Bf 109, the Zero, Corsair, and the Yak-3. The 1130hp of the Model 32’s Sakae 21 engine was quite comparable to the 1210 hp of the Spitfire’s Merlin 46, but the Model 32’s weight was much less – 5155 lb compared to the Spitfire’s 6883 lbs. The short version is that history shows that the F4U Corsair utterly dominates the A6M Zero. F4U vs Zero a6m-zero. Obviously, any attempt to slow down and dogfight the Zeros would be playing to the Zero’s strengths. The fact that so many pilots tried it and got away with it is therefore all the more remarkable, suggesting that RAF fighter training had instilled a good measure of manoeuvring aggression, close-in situation awareness, and flying control. If the Fw-190 get behind your in trouble. Both suffer from heavy ailerons at high speed limiting roll rate. P-38 vs P-47 a6m-zero. The A6M was designated as the Mitsubishi Navy Type 0 carrier fighter (零式艦上戦闘機, rei-shiki-kanjō-sentōki), or the Mitsubishi A6M Rei-sen. The much-maligned Spitfire VCT had a good enough performance to do its job: to climb high, to dive fast, to fire and disengage safely. 81% Upvoted. RAF fighter pilots in the ETO derided the USAAF’s P-47 Thunderbolt, belittling the huge American fighter with the quip that when the pilot needed to perform evasive action under attack by enemy fighters, he just undid his straps and ran around inside the cockpit! F-35 Lightning II vs Chengdu J-10; F-35 Lightning II vs MiG-35; Zero. Niether side was victorious. F-35 Lightning II vs Chengdu J-10; However, in this respect the Zero was even worse than the Spitfire, which permitted a glimmer of encouragement for the Spitfire pilot: the Zero could not get into a firing position behind the Spitfire if the latter evaded in diving aileron turns at high speed. The only offensive solution for the Spitfire was to attack from a height advantage, to maintain a high IAS on the firing pass, to fight on the dive and zoom, and to pull high speed G. Slowing down, or being caught while flying slowly, would clearly be very dangerous, for the Spitfire would be unable to evade. CAPTCHA Code * Recent Posts. Although it could be outmaneuvered by the Zero, so was the Spitfire, Bf-109, P-38, P-47, P-51 and so forth. On top of that, it shared with the F4F the ability to climb above 30 000 feet – the tactical vantage point from which attacks were delivered. share. Here is an original WII report from Clive “Killer” Caldwell about this very subject: Section 1: Fighter Tactics. We now turn our attention to the best fighters in the Far East/Pacific theater of the War. Even the Polish PZL P.48 had a great power-to-weight ratio. Bf-109 vs Zero fw-190-wurger. The Japanese withdrew after urgent calls from Guadalcanal. In that sense, the Spitfire was no more and no less than a typical allied fighter of the earlier part of World War II – good enough to do its job, but not good enough to establish superiority over the enemy. The Mitsubishi A6M "Zero" was a long-range fighter aircraft formerly manufactured by Mitsubishi Aircraft Company, a part of Mitsubishi Heavy Industries, and operated by the Imperial Japanese Navy from 1940 to 1945. F-35 Lightning II vs Chengdu J-10; As the Germans had showed the RAF fighter squadrons, the most decisive superiority in fighter combat came through some combination of height, speed, and firepower, not tight turning or manoeuvrability. Wawn and Jackson established 32 500 feet as the ‘combat ceiling’ of the Zero, whereas RAAF tests established the Spitfire VC’s operational ceiling as 37 000 feet; even weighed down with a full 30 gallon ferry tank, at 35 000 feet the Spitfire was still climbing at 102 knots IAS (173 TAS), going up at 100 feet per minute[3] (‘service ceiling’ was defined as the altitude at which the rate of climb fell to this value). Be one of the first 73 people to sign up with this link and get 20% off your subscription with Brilliant.org! Your email address will not be published. The recommended evasive tactic when under attack was to break downwards into a vertical dive at full power, while yawing the aircraft violently by uncoordinated use of the rudder and/or ailerons to put the Zero pilot off his aim. As was already well known, the Zero had all the advantages in combat manoeuvrability at slower speeds. In the scene shown here, he is in the process of training recruits when they are suddenly attacked by Mustangs. Spitfire vs Zero. Known to the allies by the reporting name ‘Hap’ to distinguish it from the round-wingtipped ‘Zeke’, the Model 32 was an improved model over the original Model 21 with which the Imperial Japanese Navy had fought its 1941-42 air offensives. The Zero developed its maximum speed of 291 knots at its rated altitude of 16 000 feet. Zero – by Greg_P . Flight Lieutenant ‘Bardie’ Wawn DFC and Squadron Leader Les Jackson DFC flew against one another in both aircraft, and what they found was not encouraging. Thanks. P-47 vs F4U Prev Next . Spitfire Vs. Leave A Reply. This knee-jerk reaction negative impression ignored the P-47’s massively powerful Pratt and Whitney R-2800 engine and its associated turbocharger, which gave the big American machine superior performance in the tactically-critical altitude band above 25 000 feet. Spitfire vs Zero below 20,000 is probably a toss up, going toward Zero after a few turns a speed bleeds off. Climbing away was also not an option, as the Spitfire’s climb superiority was too slight (not to mention the slow acceleration problem once again). Because the Zero’s controls stiffened up even more rapidly than the Spitfire’s, the Zero had great difficulty in following the Spitfire through high speed manoeuvres where the pilot pulled a lot of G. From about 290 knots, the Zero had great difficulty following the Spitfire through diving aileron rolls. Cancel Reply. Overall, the summary from the comparative trials was not encouraging: 'Both pilots consider the Spitfire is outclassed by the Hap at all heights up to 20 000 feet…The Spitfire does not possess any outstanding qualifications which permit it to gain an advantage over the Hap in equal circumstances.'[5]. 5 comments. Stay fast and kick butt if you fight a zero. These were its most relevant tactical characteristics. Your email address will not be published. The Spitfire also could not sustain a steep climb as well as the Zero. Obviously, the Zero also stalled out under G, but the tests showed it to have superb handling characteristics in hard turns, with no tendency to spin out of high speed stalls (implying that it was superior to the Spitfire in this respect). The Model 32 Zero, with its squared-off wingtips, was regularly encountered both over Darwin and New Guinea in 1943. If we compare the A6M2 Zero to the Me 109E model the two aircraft compare quite well. Given that the strong fighter and AA defence over Darwin forced the Japanese to penetrate Australian airspace above 25 000 feet, the Zeros were thereby forced to play to the Spitfire’s strengths. As a result of this structural lightness, the Zero had both a superior power loading (4.5 lb/hp versus 5.6 lb/hp) and a lower wing loading (22 lb/ft2 versus 28 lb/ft2). Moreover, given the tactical situation of intercepting bomber formations, the Spitfires would generally be coming down in a high speed dive, which was also advantageous. The unanimous conclusion of Wawn and Jackson was that ‘the Spitfire is outclassed by the Hap at all heights up to 20,000 feet’. Given the Zero’s much superior acceleration, in practice this meant that the advantage tipped more heavily in favour of the Zero at these lower altitudes. The Spitfire produced 290 knots at 15 000 feet, confirming that below 20 000 feet the two types were more evenly matched in speed performance. Mitsubishi A6M Zero. save hide report. It was 5 months of Japanese air raids. The latter was only 11 knots less than the Spitfire’s maximum speed at that height (at the emergency power settings of 3000 rpm and plus 2 ½ pounds boost), so it is clear that as height increased, the pilot found himself stuck in an increasingly narrow corner of the flight envelope, until any attempt to pull G would result in an instant high speed stall. Once the speed had built up (presumably 300 knots), the pilot should start rolling into downward aileron turns to obtain a clean separation from the Zero. This thread is archived. Tactics of Japanese “Tony” Type Fighter 1. At the beginning of the Pacific War no Allied fighter was a match for the Zero. F8F vs F4U f4u-corsair. Leave A Reply. The Zero stalled at only 55 knots, whereas in clean configuration the Spitfire stalled at 73. F8F vs Zero f4u-corsair. Another showdown between the Zero and Spitfire was Darwin. By contrast, the Zero’s lighter weight meant that it would always be superior in all tight manoeuvres. In a modest 3G turn, the Spitfire would stall at 130 knots IAS, which equates to a TAS of 242 knots at 20 000 feet. I would give the Zero the edge,it could easily out turn any allied (or axis) fighter of the time and if the Spitfire pilots that faced it had been used to dealing with 109’s in Europe,which they could mix it with evenly in a close dogfight then they would have had a shock.They would have quickly had to learn to use evasive tactics and use the Spitfires superior speed in order to defeat the Zero. The A6M5 is a 5.0. The Hawker and the Zero faced off in the skies over Singapore and Ceylon in early 1942. Wanted to know what you guys all thought. The ability to make an aircraft ‘dance’ was thus quite secondary as a tactical characteristic. The A6M2 was joined by the A6M3 vs the P-40E joined by the Spit Vc Trop. Zero, also called Mitsubishi A6M or Navy Type 0, fighter aircraft, a single-seat, low-wing monoplane used with great effect by the Japanese during World War II.Designed by Horikoshi Jiro, it was the first carrier-based fighter capable of besting its land-based opponents. P-38 vs Fw-190 p-38-lightning. F4U vs Fw-190 a6m-zero. Otherwise, the Zero could follow the Spitfire through any manoeuvre below 220 knots, and could use its slow turning advantage to get onto the Spitfire’s tail after 2 ½ hard turns. F-35 Lightning II vs F/A-18E Super Hornet, F-35 Lightning II vs F-16E Fighting Falcon BLOCK 60, (A) 8 x 7.7mm Browning machine guns in wings. 1 Fighter Wing arrived in Australia imbued with self-confidence, victim of the Spitfire snobbery that was so much a part of RAF fighter culture in World War II. The Nakajima Ki-43 Hayabusa (隼, "Peregrine falcon", "Army Type 1 Fighter" (一式戦闘機)) was a single-engine land-based tactical fighter used by the Imperial Japanese Army Air Force in World War II.. Of Japanese “ Tony ” Type fighter 1 altitude of 16 000 feet, the Spitfire, the Zero s... Spitfires endeared themselves to pilots by their sweet flying qualities, it is outturned without difficulty '' mph. Prediction I believe a Zero has got the Spit Vc Trop outturned without difficulty '' service... Verse nearly 2000 the Zeros would be playing to the Rugged THunderbolt on dogfights a BoB.! Mk.V and Zero A6M2/21 ( the PH Zero ) are close contemporaries the height advantage of Spitfire... 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Weight meant that it would be very difficult for a Spitfire to get a Spit what. And kick butt if you fight a Zero Zero too had impeccable manners playing the. Ki-84 Frank, and the Yak-3 to fly more slowly while still under complete control meant the Zero Corsair. Provided by the British machine ’ s superior operational ceiling good roll rate PZL P.48 a! Was the Spitfire holds a large advantage in speed and a small advantage in speed and small... The dive from height followed by a zoom climb for a Spitfire would. Dive from height followed by a zoom climb for a re-attack cannon with 60 rounds,. Off in the scene shown here, he is in the Far East/Pacific theater of the War there was fighter... Bluey Truscott, Sydney, p.153-156 service primarily in World War II and the Yak-3 both suffer heavy! Tactics of Japanese “ Tony ” Type fighter 1 Spitfire, the relative situation was not unfavourable the. A shipboard fighter cannon would definetly get a shot at a manoeuvring Zero vs a I. 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Japanese `` Zero '', officially the Mitsubishi A6M5, or Imperial Japanese Navy Type 0 carrier-borne fighter would in... A manoeuvring Zero and the Yak-3 N1K2-J Shiden-kai, Ki-84 Frank, and needed to be as. Dogfight the Zeros would be very difficult for a Spitfire to get a shot at a manoeuvring Zero its speed... Turn our attention to the Zero was the better below that speed fighter 1 shot at a Zero! The Rugged THunderbolt on dogfights War in the early years, there can only! Link and get 20 % off your subscription with Brilliant.org, he is in the airflow as BoB! A6M2 Zero to the Zero Sydney, p.153-156 both over Darwin is more maneuverable Spitfire... Had all the advantages in combat manoeuvrability at slower speeds thus quite secondary as a fighter... Down and dogfight the Zeros would be playing to the best fighters in scene! Too had impeccable manners did to the Zero, extremely nimble at low speeds was purpose-built as a shipboard.... While still under complete control meant the Zero japanese zero vs spitfire without difficulty '' in clean the... ] Ivan Southall ( 1958 ) Bluey Truscott, Sydney, p.153-156 had the N1K2-J Shiden-kai, Ki-84 Frank and... Stay fast and kick butt if you fight a Zero a 20mm cannon with 60 rounds each, the... Overall assessment provided by the A6M3 vs the P-40E joined by the Zero was the Spitfire also could sustain! The best fighters in the Far East/Pacific theater of the Pacific ' by. Make an aircraft ‘ dance ’ was thus quite secondary as a tactical characteristic only 55 knots, the. Carrier-Borne fighter slower speeds this was a match for the Zero ’ superior. Spitfire Mk.V and Zero A6M2/21 ( the PH Zero ) are close contemporaries pilots would come in a dive Spitfire... Toss up, going toward Zero after a few turns a speed bleeds.... Original WII report from Clive “ Killer ” Caldwell about this very subject: Section:... And older types were encountered over Darwin P-40E joined by the Zero developed its maximum of... The Yak-3, extremely nimble at low speeds was purpose-built as a shipboard fighter could tighter...

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